Vickie Speek is here to talk about Strangite temple ceremonies, and the introduction of polygamy among the Strangites. Check out our conversation…
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Gospel Tangents
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Except for book reviews, no content may be reproduced without written permission.
Strangite Temple
GT 00:46 I know Cheryl Bruno has that that new book on masonry. Have you had a chance to read it yet by chance?
Vickie 00:52 No, I’ve started it.
GT 00:53 Because it seems like she said there was something to do, (because I haven’t read it either.) It seems like she had said there was something to do with this Strangite Temple, as well, in there. But you’re not familiar with that either?
Vickie 01:04 Yes I am.
GT 01:05 Oh, you are? Can you touch on that? Can you share?
Vickie 01:07 It’s called the Order of the Illuminati.
GT 01:09 Okay.
Vickie 01:10 And that was John Bennett’s thing. He wanted everybody to become Illuminati’s, part of the secret organization. It is very much like the Freemasons. When people were anointed to be an Illuminati and the secret group of people, they were in Voree first. And then they transferred over to Beaver Island. And they took a covenant. And some people said they signed it with their own blood, to support James Strang as the leader, as their prophet, king, and priest, and over anybody else in the nation, or the world. He was king of the kingdom, the kingdom of God on earth.
GT 01:10 And that has nothing to do with masonry?
Vickie 02:10 It has the same symbols and the same wording, as some of the Freemasonry signs and tokens.
GT 02:20 Was it just a different order of masonry? Because I’ve heard of the Scottish Rite. I can’t remember the other kinds.
Vickie 02:30 Royal Arch.
GT 02:31 Yeah, the Royal Arch masonry. So, was the order of Illuminati just a different flavor of masonry?
Vickie 02:39 I’m not really sure what they were supposed to do, except that they were given royal titles. It’s supposed to be royalty. You’re going to have James Strang as the primate. And you’ve got lords and earls and different royal titles like that. And I’m not really sure what they were going to do with it. But John C. Bennett wanted certificates done. Everybody could have their own certificate, and they would say their name and their height, and description of what they looked like and the whole bit. He was really into certificates like that.
John C Bennett
GT 03:24 So do you think John C. Bennett had anything to do with [polygamy]? I know you said, James started polygamy before. But was there encouragement from John and/or William Smith? It seems like those are the two big polygamy guys in Strangism.
Vickie 03:40 I think that they probably talked about it. And they may have encouraged James Strang.
GT 03:47 And said, Joseph Smith practiced it.
Vickie 03:50 And told him. Then, apparently, there were some incidents in Voree where John C. Bennett apparently had tried to talk women into illicit intercourse with him and said that it was fine. And the same thing with William Smith.
GT 04:12 As long as nobody knows about it, it’s fine. That’s convenient.
Vickie 04:15 That’s right. And Dr. Bennett could provide abortions for them, should the woman become pregnant.
GT 04:23 Do you believe he performed abortions? That was in Nauvoo, right?
Vickie 04:27 No this was in Voree.
GT 04:29 Oh, that was in Voree? Okay, because there’s rumors that he did that in Nauvoo, too. Do you have any comment on the Nauvoo era?
Vickie 04:36 Supposedly there was a community outside of Nauvoo where they took the babies that were born, I’ve heard. Have you heard that?
GT 04:45 I haven’t heard that.
Vickie 04:46 Okay, there were abortions. And there were women that would not give up their babies, but they were taken and given to this community.
GT 04:55 In Nauvoo.
Vickie 04:57 Outside of Nauvoo.
GT 04:58 Yeah. Because I heard a lot of people–it seems like Mark Tensmeyer and Brian Hales, I’m pretty sure. I’m not sure about Todd Compton. [Mark & Brian] have questioned these abortion claims from Nauvoo. But are you pretty sure that abortions happen in Voree?
Vickie 05:21 No.
GT 05:22 Or Beaver Island?
Vickie 05:23 I’m not sure about either one.
GT 05:24 Okay. What’s your best guess?
Vickie 05:30 I don’t think so.
GT 05:31 You don’t think that happened in either place?
Vickie 05:33 No. I do know that there was somebody who was caught with William Smith, but I don’t know anything about abortions.
GT 05:43 Okay.
Vickie 05:44 I don’t know. Because John C. Bennett served the town of Burlington. He served the women in Burlington, and they weren’t all Strangites.
GT 05:5 He was kind of the OB/GYN of Voree.
Vickie 05:59 He was the gynecologist.
GT 06:02 Okay.
Vickie 06:05 So I don’t know.
GT 06:06 So he certainly was in a position to do that if he chose.
Vickie 06:11 Right.
GT 06:12 Okay. That’s interesting. Did he sour on James Strang, as well, as he did on Joseph Smith?
Vickie 06:24 No, they soured on him.
GT 06:28 What was the issue there?
Vickie 06:32 You’re talking about the Voree days again. And there were a lot of pseudos there who just did not like him. And they said, “Get rid of these guys. Get rid of William Smith and John C. Bennett. Because they’re causing division in your church. And they’re trying to cause problems here. Get rid of them.” And apparently, James Strang listened to them.
Fleeing Voree & Starting Polygamy
Interview
GT 06:59 Okay, we’ll jump to them in a little bit. Okay, so, back to Beaver Island. He has his first plural wife, Elvira Fields. And then he gets three more?
Vickie 07:12 Well, what happened is that the settlement on Voree was no longer sustainable for Strangites. The property values had become inflated. And there were so many poor people moving in there that could not afford the land, and there was just so much division from the pseudos, those people that had been Strangites that had left the church, but they didn’t leave the community. They left the church, but they still lived there. Like I said, they would meet people outside on the roads that were intending on going to see James Strang.
GT 07:54 Same types of problems as Missouri.
Vickie 07:56 Yes. So James Strang found an island. He was led to it by a vision, a wonderful island in Lake Michigan that he was led to. He started to take his people there. And they set up homes and fishing. It was very sparsely settled. There were some Indian traders there. There were some fishermen, a handful of white people, but mostly Indians. And that’s where James Strang said the kingdom of God was going to be. So, he moved everybody from Voree to Beaver Island. And then he announced that he was going to be the king. And he had a coronation. And that’s where his followers were. They signed a covenant that they would honor him above anybody else, including the rulers of the United States, because he was the king. And then they had a lot of controversy with the Gentiles who didn’t really care for these people coming in there with their own king.
GT 08:13 Kings and democracies don’t work very well, do they? At least that’s what the British found out.
Vickie 09:26 Exactly. There was a 32-year-old Old Maid in the community, Betsy McNutt. And apparently, she wasn’t really much to look at, but she was a really good cook. And she really took good care of the home. And she said that there was only one man that she would ever even consider marrying. And that was James Strang, which put him in the hot seat because he had announced that polygamy was okay. Well, so far.
GT 09:58 So that was public.
Vickie 10:00 He went publicly.
GT 10:01 So this is before the official announcement, which I think was 1853 where Orson Pratt announced it for the LDS Church. So Strang beat him to the punch?
Vickie 10:11 Yes, he did. He publicly announced that polygamy would be practiced on Beaver Island. And now he has an Old Maid woman who says that the only man should ever marry was the prophet himself. And in the Law of the Lord, it says that the woman should have the choice in choosing a righteous man as a husband. So, he took plural wife number two. So, Elvira was in charge of his letters. She was his secretary, and his soulmate. And Betsy took care of the house and the babies. And then later on, he met two young women that were 18 and 19 years old, that he also took as wives. And all four of those women were pregnant at the time when James Strang was murdered. The first wife left the island.
GT 11:16 Oh, she was tired of this.
Vickie 11:18 Yeah.
GT 11:18 Did she leave with Elvira?
Vickie 11:22 She left after Elvira’s baby was born.
GT 11:26 Okay.
Vickie 11:26 She was basically kicked off the island.
GT 11:30 By James?
Vickie 11:31 Yes. And it was a very big mystery that I solved. Nobody knew why Mary had left the island, because she had been set up as part of a committee for ruling the island. And she apparently was okay with him having another wife. And I happen to find some galley proofs in the archives, for a book. It was about the history of Charlevoix County. And inside these galleys–it was going to be printed. It was actually printed in the newspapers as a serial. I can’t remember what years, but next to the galleys, somebody had written that Mary tried to kill Elvira’s baby.
GT 12:31 Oh, no.
Vickie 12:33 And it was the person who was writing that message, that was the baby as a grown-up. It was Elvira’s son, Charles, who had seen that galley and it said that Mary was a wonderful woman. And she stayed on the island. And he wrote to the side, “This is wrong. This is not true. Mary left the island after she tried to kill Elvira’s baby.”
GT 13:03 Which was himself.
Vickie 13:05 Which was him.
GT 13:05 Wow. How would he know that?
Vickie 13:08 His mother told him so.
GT 13:09 Oh, really?
Vickie 13:12 So, you’ve got a lot of, so many twists and turns and it’s really an interesting story.
GT 13:20 You know, it brings up the book. I know, I think I asked you at John Whitmer, but it wasn’t on video. And Kyle–it seemed like there was a third person there. [I asked you] what did you think of King of Confidence? What are your thoughts?
Vickie 13:26 I think that is a very good book. And he’s been able to come across with some more information. As far as I’m concerned, the more information we can all compile together, the better off we are. However, I think that it was a little disrespectful towards the Strangites. He really portrayed James Strang as a con man. And to me, James Strang was a con man at the beginning, but then he started beginning to believe his own lies. And the people, obviously, believed in him. But the people weren’t stupid. And they weren’t foolish. They just simply believed in this man, and he fooled them.
GT 14:31 And he fooled himself?
Vickie 14:33 Yes.
GT 14:35 Could we call him a pious fraud? I know that’s the term people like to give to Joseph Smith. Was that the plight of James Strang?
Vickie 14:41 Yes.
GT 14:42 You think so?
Vickie 14:43 Yeah. [And] I think that’s what happened with Joseph Smith, that he started believing his own stories.
GT 14:52 What else happened? So, how many wives are we into now? So the first one…
Vickie 14:56 The first one left. She got kicked off for trying to kill a baby.
GT 15:00 Elvira/Charlie Douglas had a son, Charles.
Vickie 15:04 Yes, his name was Charles Douglas.
GT 15:06 Really? I was wondering about that. And then the third one’s name was…
Vickie 15:12 Betsy McNutt, Elizabeth McNutt. And then there was Sarah Wright. Her father was one of the apostles.
GT 15:22 Oh, really?
Vickie 15:23 And then there was Phoebe Wright, who was a cousin to Sarah. And her father was the bishop of the church. So, they grew up in the church, in Voree, and belonged to the communal order that was there. And I think that, as children, they were taught that everything belongs to the Prophet. And they were expected to become wives of the Prophet. They never doubted.
GT 15:56 Was there a limit in the Book of the Law of the Lord how many wives a person can have?
Vickie 16:01 Yes, a man could only have as many as he could adequately support. He had to have the means, ahead of time, to be able to support an additional one.
GT 16:12 I was thinking it was four, for some reason. So, it’s not an exact number, it’s just–So, Solomon was okay with hie 700 wives and 300 concubines.
Vickie 16:21 As long as he could support them.
GT 16:25 Okay, all right. So, he ends up with four wives. Do we know when the last– were the fourth and the fifth [wives] at the same time?
Vickie 16:39 No, they were a few weeks apart, I think maybe three months, three or four months apart.
GT 16:44 Do you know approximately what year that was?
Vickie 16:48 Yes. I believe they were both in 1855.
GT 16:53 Okay.
Vickie 16:53 One was in July of 1855. And then I think one was in October of 1855.
GT 17:02 And then I learned from Kyle that there is probable concubine after this, as well. So, the Book of the Law of the Lord regulates concubines, too?
Vickie 17:13 Yes.
GT 17:13 What’s the difference between a concubine and a plural wife, according to…
Vickie 17:16 I don’t know.
GT 17:17 You don’t know, that’s a theology question.
Vickie 17:19 There you go, that’s theology. The concubines are women that the Prophet would have children with, but they would not be acknowledged as wives, for some reason. I don’t know why. And there were at least two that are suspected as being concubines.
GT 17:43 Two, oh, because Kyle told us Eunice Kenney. Do you know the other one?
Vickie 17:49 Her last name was Townsend. Mrs. Townsend, she was married. And so was Eunice Kenney. She was married, too. So, maybe that’s why they would be concubines.
GT 18:04 Oh, so with the other four, they were all never married before?
Vickie 18:09 Correct.
GT 18:10 Oh, that’s interesting. So, maybe that’s what the difference is. Oh, okay. And so there was some sort of a sealing. And, as far as we know, this will be similar to an LDS sealing, a plural marriage sealing? Do you know?
Vickie 18:24 I don’t know. Strang never approached his women, in person, to ask for their hand in marriage. He always sent a delegate, one of his apostles or so forth. And then they were married in private ceremonies with just a few people in attendance. They would be married by one of the apostles.
GT 18:57 You have no idea how similar their ceremonies were to LDS.
Vickie 19:00 No.
GT 19:01 Okay. It’s not recorded. It’s not recorded. Because he’s only got about a year of his life left, right?
King & Congressman!
GT 19: So, most everything he did is done by 1855. Is there anything in that last year? And if not, let’s talk about his death.
Vickie 19:17 Oh, you mean like him being a state representative?
GT 19:21 Oh, yes. Was that in his last year of his life?
Vickie 19:23 That was 1852. And then he was reelected again in 1854.
GT 19:27 Okay. And that was the Michigan House of Representatives.
Vickie 19:31 Yes.
GT 19:31 Okay. I’m trying to remember, somebody was like, “He was a king and a senator.”
Vickie 19:36 A king and a senator, at the same time. He was very responsible, and he was very futuristic, planning for the future. He had planned for roads across Michigan. He was very much into women’s rights. He believed, as I said, that women have the right to choose their husband, even in polygamy. And Charlie Douglas was very much for the rights of women and for union workers. He was very progressive in his thoughts, and he had a lot of very good ideas for Michigan. He even thought about a bridge that should go from Lower Michigan to Upper Michigan. And, of course, they had to wait a long time to get that bridge, but it’s there, now.
GT 20:30 Oh, it is there. It doesn’t connect Beaver Island.
Vickie 20:34 No. Beaver Island is a wonderful place. It’s a very, very unique place. It’s not at all like Mackinaw Island where you have fudge shops and lots and lots of gift shops and klutzy things and hotels and lots of tourists. Beaver Island is very laid back and easy, but it’s not old-fashioned. It’s just laid back and easy.
GT 21:06 We’ll try really hard to see if we can get a trip out there. And when me and Vickie figure it out, I’ll put it on Facebook or something.
Vickie 21:16 Okay.
GT 21:16 I want to go so bad.
Vickie 21:18 Well, we used to have a group that would meet on Beaver Island every year.
GT 21:22 Oh, really?
Vickie 21:22 It was called the Society of Strang Scholars, something like that.
GT 21:29 Oh, SSS, okay.
Vickie 21:33 The Strang Society, but it fell apart because the primary organizers had passed away. And so it just fell apart.
GT 21:44 And nobody picked it up.
Vickie 21:46 So we tried, for a while.
GT 21:48 They do have tours on Beaver Island, don’t they?
Vickie 21:50 Yes, they do. And if you want to have a Beaver Island Tour, go head and then I’ll give you a tour. And it will be completely different.
GT 22:00 Yeah, I can’t wait because you’re going to have the map ready.
Vickie 22:04 I will have the map ready. Now there’s one thing that I cannot figure out. I cannot figure out where the dead people went. Because there’s no Strangite cemeteries on Beaver Island.
GT 22:18 It wouldn’t have been a burial at sea.
Vickie 22:21 Maybe people just buried their people on their own land, instead of in a cemetery. But there’s no cemeteries from the Strangites. And we know that there were probably at least half a dozen people who died on Beaver Island.
{End of Part 3}
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Gospel Tangents
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